compact gun question

[Pat]

There is a used Beretta Cougar in the case at Bill's south. Very nice gun, and not very big. The price seemed reasonable.

I believe the mag holds 8 rounds of .45 ACP.

[Rags3000]

...but I have yet to see one that would be more than about 2 ounces lighter then mine. (I think it weighed 14 ounces, empty, last time I put it on a sensitive scale.) But 2 ounces hardly seems worth it. It's getting to the point that the ammo is a big chunk of the total weight of the package.

Keltec P3AT: 8oz empty + 3oz magazine + 3oz magazine = 14oz

No doubt you are correct. What I had in mind, though, was a 9mm or .38 Special plus-P, for a minimum amount of gun. I do not know if any of those come in weights lighter than about 12 ounces, empty, but I think not.

I am not dissing the .380, though. I like them. And any gun is better than no gun, but there's a certain minimum level of stopping power -- allthough few people can agree on it, my guess is that probably the 9 mm is bottom of the range for most people. That said, bad guys have absorbed .45 ACPs in the chest and even .30-30s in the heart and kept on coming.

[hammAR]

...........and a lot of people have died with .22 in them too.........
.........or for that matter sharp little sticks, just ask Custer......

[JoeH]

I'm an average sized American. I find that a j-frame pocket carries really well. Note that some are heavier than others by a good half-pound.

The little autos are slim. But I'll trade that for a revolver that I can draw safely and shoot accurately even in the dark.

Average sized for whom?

Since Americans are getting so fat I figured that 295 was about average (yep, lost 25 pounds).

[josh2415]

Get your hands on a ruger LCP and give it a shot. (every pun intended). I carry mine on a daily basis as both a primary or a secondary depending on the circumstances. Compact, managable, and endlessly concealable, not to mention inexpensive.

Ditto on the LCP. Great for pocket carry - almost forget that I'm carrying it.

[Pinnacle]

If I were looking for a small gun - I would certainly look at the LCP and I would also keep in mind that smallish autos are notoriously finicky and unreliable. I do not care for a small gun - I figure that it is worth the hassle for me to wear clothing that helps me conceal a G19 (as small as I would go) - If I am going to need a gun to fight for my life I would be willing to bet that I would not want one that was well, unreliable or of small magazine capacity, or with crude sights, or had to operate when the thing screws up because my hand got hit by the slide (gripping small guns properly under stress is nearly impossible.)

But OTOH I suppose that having a small auto with you when you would leave another at home is a good thing. My recommendation would be to PRACTICE with the small guns a LOT to get to know their limitations, and well, yours as well. I would stage malfunctions to try to clear them at the range and I would make darn sure that you are carrying an additional mag with a small auto - there are just some problems that cannot be solved without the proper application of MORE AMMO.

Lots of people say - "I don't shoot my pocket gun a lot or well, ever because it beats me up." All that I have to say to that is BUTCH UP SALLY Pain is just weakness leaving the body...... Shoot those small autos.... A LOT.

[Paul]

I would stage malfunctions ...

From my experience, the LCP's seem to do that fine on their own.

[plblark]

It's a small gun with a THIN grip that's not too deep and a long heavy trigger pull firing .380 ACP ... a recipe for limp wristing and user induced error if I ever heard one ...

I've never had an issue with mine. Either I've been really lucky or very careful in practice. I get a good grip, I practice with the gun, it works for me. YMMV.

Of course, it took me a box or more of ammo to get it figured out as far as aiming, trigger pull, finger placement, grip ... It's not a big gun that fits your hand and just shoots for anyone. You need to practice with it and work out the kinks in your shooting to get the most you can out of it.

But it's small, reliable, and always around

[Pinnacle]

I would stage malfunctions ...

From my experience, the LCP's seem to do that fine on their own.

Hence the problem with small autos. I used to carry a Walther PPK/S as a secondary weapon in NY while I was working in an ankle holster - good gun BUT it only worked with BALL UMC ammo...

[Pinnacle]

I would stage malfunctions ...

From my experience, the LCP's seem to do that fine on their own.

Hence the problem with small autos. I used to carry a Walther PPK/S as a secondary weapon in NY while I was working in an ankle holster - good gun BUT it only worked with BALL UMC ammo...

The bottom line is this - Small revolvers are basically 100% reliable and easy to shoot and control with well, one exposed moving part - small autos are complicated little machines that only take a little belly button fuzz to foul up..... Smith&Wesson Scandium 38's are the bees knees for small guns and here is the best part - they are not ammo sensitive - FMJ's JHP's, HBWC's makes no difference whatsoever. I recommend HBWC's for snubbies.

[sochr000]

Well, I decided, I'll just get one of everything mentioned! I picked up a P3at the other day, probably going to start paying on a Bersa here soon, and there's a couple of the mentioned small revolvers for sale locally. I'll let you all know what works best for me and my smallish hands.

[Pat]

I have a Beretta Tomcat in .32 ACP. It is dead nuts reliable, and I have put quite a few rounds through. It is mechanically very simple, so there isn't much to go wrong.

As far as it being a smallish caliber, I am sure that three to the face would be sufficient to deter many a wanton heathen. I once fired this pistol at a box full of phonebooks I had been using in my basement as a backstop for an air rifle. It went through the entire box, went through the carpeting and underlayment and embedded itself into about an inch of the concrete floor.

That made a believer out of me as far as penetration goes. I figured it whould get stuck somewhere in the middle of the third phone book.

[hammAR]

...but you live in a small town and the phone book is only 25 pages....invalid test....

[JoeH]

I once fired this pistol at a box full of phonebooks I had been using in my basement as a backstop for an air rifle. It went through the entire box, went through the carpeting and underlayment and embedded itself into about an inch of the concrete floor.

I'm just glad that you moved out of the neighborhood.

[Magnum Mikie]

My wife and I both had Bersa .380's. After shooting mine, my wife decided the grip was too bulky for her small hands so I sold it to one of the prominent members on this forum . Then, while at a LGS my wife tried holding a Bersa .380 Concealed Carry which has a smaller grip with finger grooves. Turns out that this nickel Bersa .380 CC followed us home. After shooting her .380 CC, I decided I liked the Concealed Carry .380 better than the regular .380.............so, long story short.........we now both have the smaller CC model. Sold my regular Bersa .380 to a friend.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/pianoman5355317/Bersa380CC001.jpg

There's more. We both also carry a LCP as a pocket gun during warm weather. The Bersa and LCP have both been reliable. However, I wouldn't recommend the LCP as a range gun.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/pianoman5355317/BerettaLCPand40ammo007.jpg

During winter months I carry my Bersa .45 UC.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0903/pianoman5355317/Bersa45.jpg

We've fired about 500-600 rds through each Bersa with zero problems. The LCP's have about 200 flawless rds through them, but like I said, they don't make good range guns.